Lisa Kreutz

Lisa Kreutz

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Witness Location:

LIBRARY, INJURED

11k page report – witness testimony

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Kreutz, Lisa

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FEDERAL BUREAU OF INVESTIGATION

Date of transcription: 5-12-99

Lisa Michelle Kreutz, date of birth January 14, 1981, [REDACTED], was interviewed at her home in the presence of her parents, Ken and Sheryl Kreutz. After being advised of the identity of the interviewing agent and Diane Obbema, Investigator, Jefferson County Sheriff’s Office, Kreutz furnished the following information:

Kreutz is a Senior at Columbine High School. Her first class of the day is Trigonometry with Mr. Tank. This class is during second period which runs from 8:25 AM to 9:20 AM. This class period is extended an extra five minutes for announcements to be made. The Rebel News Network is broadcast over televisions within the classrooms. Her class really didn’t pay attention to the announcements on a regular basis. On April 20, 1999, Kreutz wasn’t really paying attention to the announcements and does not recall anything that seemed unusual.

Period three runs from 9:25 to 10:15 AM. During this period, Kreutz has accounting with Mr. Stoeklen. Her fourth period class is Psychology with T.J., last name unknown. Kreutz couldn’t recall the teacher’s last name as they all refer to him as T.J. This class runs from 10:20 AM to 11:10 AM. Fifth period, or A Lunch, begins at 11:15 AM. This is Kreutz’s lunch period, and she usually goes to the library or out to lunch with Jessica Holliday and Bethany Koch. Prior to going to lunch or the library, she would typically go to her locker and exchange schoolbooks.

On April 20, 1999, after fourth period, Kreutz did not go to her locker to exchange schoolbooks. Instead, she went to the Post Graduate Center and picked up an application for the University of Colorado at Denver. She then walked down the hall to the library. In the Library, Kreutz would usually sit with Holliday, Jeanna Park, and Diwata Perez on the East side of the library. She entered the library at approximately 11:15 AM. Holliday was already in the library at table #2. Kreutz met Perez and Park in the Library or possibly at or near her locker. Kreutz was in the middle of Park and Holliday on the East side of table #2, facing West. On the West side of the table was Lauren Townsend and Perez. There may have been another girl in the middle of the West side of the table. At that time, the

Investigation on 5-5-99 at Littleton, Colorado    

Control #DN2109

File # 174A-DN-57419        

Date dictated: 5-11-99

By SA John M. Elvig/ms

This document contains neither recommendations nor conclusions of the FBI. It is the property of the FBI and is loaned to your agency: it and its contacts are not to be distributed outside your agency.

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library was pretty full, but Kreutz could not remember seeing anybody else she knew. There are two reading chairs with a small table between them, next to table #2 and against the East wall. There may have been someone seated at one of the reading chairs.

A couple of minutes after sitting down, Holliday left their table and went over to the computer area on the West side of the library. At about that time, Kreutz heard popping sounds coming from outside the West part of the library. The sounds were like a hammer striking against a wall. Within a minute, a blonde-haired student came into the library and stated, “Where’s Miss Keating?” and, “He has a gun.” Kreutz believed this to be a student as she appeared too young to be an adult. The student then went behind the librarian’s counter. Kreutz did not know if she should believe what the student said or not and thought it may have been another senior prank. A week prior, in a senior prank, the seniors closed off the junior parking lot.

A couple minutes later, and no more than five minutes later, a lady came into the library and said to get under the tables. The students all hesitated as she yelled again to get under the tables. Right behind this lady was Mr. Place, who came into the library doors and said something to somebody that “we have to get these kids out of here.” Place then left the library.

Attachment A is a diagram of the Columbine High School library. Kreutz indicated on the diagram the sitting positions of the students at table #2. Kreutz, Perez, Townsend and Park all hid underneath their table. Kreutz was sitting under the table with her knees pulled up to her chest and she was facing the trophy case near the reference table. The window was in the upper portion of the wall.

At that point, Kreutz began hearing screaming coming from the area she believed to be the commons. Through the window to the hall outside the library, she saw a white male coming toward the library. He was moving from South to North like he had come from down by the commons. He was headed toward the library with a determined look on his face. Her view of this person was only from about the shoulders up and she described him with blonde hair and dressed in dark colors. Kreutz indicated on the library diagram the approximate location of the individual in the hallway.

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The door to the library is always propped open and she could hear two people coming into the library. She remembers hearing one of the gunmen say to the other one, “Are you still with me?” and “We’re still gonna do this, right?” After entering the library, the gunmen started yelling and moved to the West side of the library. She heard one of the gunmen say they were going to “blow up the library.” This statement was followed by an explosion sound in the library. Kreutz began hearing windows breaking, gunfire, and lots of screaming. She could not recall specifically how much gunfire she heard on the West side of the library. She did hear a statement from one of the gunmen that they hated school and that school had messed them up.

The fire alarm went off during a shooting on the west side of the library. Park’s sister, a freshman, was sitting by the computer tables. Park kept saying that she had to get her sister. Perez had to hold down Park to keep her from leaving the table. Perez told Park that Holliday was at the computer table and would take care of her sister. Kreutz thought the gunmen then moved to the middle section of the library as the sounds of gunshots and screams were getting closer to her. She could not recall any specifics of the gunmen’s movement or comments in the middle section.

After what she believes is a gunshot in the middle section, she can hear a gunman moving up around from behind her, back near table #4 and the wall. Townsend and one of the girls were praying underneath the table. Somebody under the table said, “Oh my God, they’re coming.” At the same time, she can see a gunman in her view between the trophy case and the reference table. She sees this gunman only from the chest down but can see a shotgun with possibly 2 barrels in his left hand. He was holding the gun down. He was wearing dark clothing and had something over his shirt or jacket. It was different in color than his shirt and appeared to cross over his chest and then over his shoulder.

The girls had pulled the chairs in around the table and her view was being blocked. Kreutz remembers thinking at that point that it didn’t really hurt to be shot. She believes it was the gunman that she saw between the reference table and trophy case that shot at her table.

To her right she saw Val Schnurr falling to the ground. Schnurr may have been running or crawling away from the gunman that was moving up behind their table. Schnurr had gotten shot

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and Kreutz could see her holding her side. Schnurr was screaming and then Kreutz heard a gunman from behind her ask Schnurr if she believed in God. The gunman asked it again and she recalls Schnurr answering back, “No.” At that point, Schnurr was laying on the ground next to table #2 on the East side. The gunman may have shot Schnurr again. In the course of this questioning of Schnurr or just at the completion of it, Kreutz got shot several times. Kreutz does not know if the shooting came from the gunman behind her or the gunman, she saw by the trophy case. Kreutz got shot in the left shoulder, right wrist, right ankle and a shot through the left buttock which also goes somehow through her inner thigh.

Kreutz cannot recall if Townsend was shot at the same time she was or was shot just prior to her. After the gunshots. She could see Townsend laying down on the floor “gasping” with one of the other girls holding her. The two guns that had been shot at their table sounded different. Kreutz did not think the gunmen were really aiming their guns. She thought they were just shooting without aiming at anyone.

After being shot, Kreutz does not remember if there was more gunfire and explosions within the library. She does remember Schnurr moving from her spot, as Kreutz could no longer see her. After a period of no longer than 10 minutes, the library got really quiet. Kreutz did not see the gunmen leave the library. Kreutz heard something, possibly gunshots, which gave her the impression that gunmen were gone from the library. The gunmen had been gone a long enough period of time that the students felt that they were not coming back to the library. Park and Perez got up and tried to get Kreutz to leave with them. Kreutz was unable to leave with them. Kreutz believes Park and Perez went through the bookcases by table #1 and exited out that side of the library. Kreutz saw a number of students get up and leave. After the students had left the library, Kreutz was laying down under her table and heard the school bell ring. This was the 11:45 bell, which meant that her lunch period was over. The fire alarm was still going off at that time.

Kreutz remembers another girl crawling up and laying her head down on her. The girl had blonde hair. Kreutz did not know the girl. Kreutz continued to lay under her table and heard the 11:50 AM bell and then the 12:10 and 12:15 PM bells. These bells meant that the “A” and “B” lunches were over. Kreutz

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continued to listen to the various bells for the class periods go off. The bells were how she kept track of time.

Kreutz heard a helicopter flying around outside the school and knew the police were outside the school. Kreutz remembers hearing two to three explosions in the library while the gunmen were inside the library. She heard another explosion inside the library or outside the library after all the students had gotten up and left the library. She also remembers hearing glass breaking again and again and someone say something to the effect of “hey you in the library.” She doesn’t remember when, but she heard police officers yelling from an area she thought was outside the South windows of the library.

Kreutz believes she was conscious the whole time she was laying under the table in the library. She wasn’t really paying attention and was mostly looking at the top of the table. She knew her wrist was broken, and she couldn’t move either of her arms. She remembers hearing the 2:30 PM bell ring as it just kept on ringing. A couple of times she did try to get up and leave the library. She tried once before the 2:30 PM bell to get up and leave but got “light headed.” After trying to get up, she got back down underneath her table. She believes she tried to get up again after the 2:30 bell and ended up laying down then between tables #1 and #2.

Kreutz later remembers hearing the gunmen talking in the library. The voices sounded further away but she laid very still, pretending to be dead. She didn’t want the shooting to start all over again. She does recall somebody coming back into the library while she was laying down but does not recall any details.

After trying to get up and leave following the 2:30 bell, she remembers hearing the police yelling. The yelling was in the hallway from outside the library and the sounds sounded like they were in a hurry. She heard them come in and she called for help. One of the SWAT officers came over to her. This officer told her she was the only one alive in the library. They did not take her immediately out of the library and one SWAT officer stayed with her. The next thing she remembers is a paramedic coming in and talking to her about whether she was hurt. The paramedic rolled her onto her shoulder to look at her

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back and she remembers excruciating pain. She was put on a board and remembers hearing the officer saying they had to get her out of there in a hurry.

Kreutz does remember the glass bookcase/trophy case shattering. She does not remember when this occurred. It may have been caused by the SWAT team.

Kreutz has a navy-blue Eddie Bauer backpack which she left on top of the table. Inside the backpack are a graphing calculator, her wallet, two sets of car keys, and school papers, including folders. She would like to get one set of the car keys back as those are the only two sets of keys for her car. Her grandfather had to pay a locksmith to help them get the car out of the school parking lot. Kreutz had been transferring information from her application to the University of Colorado at Denver to a new application. She was recopying it to make it more legible. There was a $40 check for admission fees with the application.

Kreutz’s locker is in the math hall area and is locker #480, #180 or something in the eighties. She had nothing valuable in her locker except books and papers. Attachment B is a diagram of Columbine High School. Kreutz indicated on the diagram the location of her locker.

Kreutz’ remembers a paramedic taking off her Eeyore watch and throwing it into her shoes. She was also wearing jewelry, including her class ring and a birthstone ring. Kreutz would like to get back her watch and rings.

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